43 replies to this topic

[cunning_plan]

he was on his way home with it, with recipt. the hard disks were taken then retuned. i to would normaly presume that ever he was being an arse or that they had something on him already except...well he's realy realy shy and would be more likely to cry than swear if you follow. could stuff on his computer already have been known? perhaps he had been on a ste that the police had set as a trap?cant see what for though.

[pritch]

Yes, but what was he doing in the first place to arouse suspicion?  Why did the police conduct a stop and search?  There has to be good reason for the police to do this!

Was he waving the barrel around?

He was probably black

[cunning_plan]

i was tempted to put "and he wasnt even of ethnic origin" mysef!

He was probably black

[ChesterPFX]

Are we sure we have all the facts here? I do not know any PC's (and I know a fair few I assure you) who would have the first clue what chemicals are used in explosives compounds, let alone recognise them.
On his arrest he would have been booked in and a parent or guardian contacted to act as an appropriate adult. If they could no be contacted, the local council social services would have been contacted and a social worker would have come to the station to ensure the well-being of your friend. He would have also been given the option of legal advice, which if he didn't have his own solicitor, would have been provided free.
His house may well have been searched if a Sec 18 had been authorised. If they had wanted his hard drive then it would have been removed and taken to be forensically examined by an HTU.
Kept in custody for 24 hrs? Only if authorised by the duty officer for the first 2 reviews, then the next review has to be conducted by an officer who is either a Superintendant or above. Happen often? No.

I would treat your story with a degree of scepticism I'm afraid. It would appear you have an issue with the old bill which might not be a great idea if you ever seek a CoER.

[cunning_plan]

one way to look at it and with much logic however...i have told you what happened(or the general gyst of it), his parents were brought in. i also dont know how they knew or recognised sulphur but perhaps like many other people they think of it as a much more important explosives chem than it is(ie he couldnt do anything with just sulphur). because something dosnt happen often does not mean it dosnt happen, especialy in this climate.if theres details you want to know il find them out for you.

[ChesterPFX]

Well I would suggest that if he parents went to the station as you say and he was kept in for 24 hrs, there must have been good reason to do so. Despite what you may believe or read, the actions of the police when it comes to a detained person have to be transparent and everything that occurs is detailed on the custody record.
If there was something going on here, it would require the complicity of the arresting officers, at least 3 custody sergeants, at least 3 gaolers, 2 duty officers, a Superintendent and a few IDO's (Who aren't even police officers)
Think of it this way: If what they did to your friend was illegal, they all risk losing their jobs. Do you really think a Supt. on at least 52k PA is going to risk his career on the arrest of a 15yr old kid?

[cunning_plan]

my point wasnt are they allowed to do this but are you allowed "sulphur and a pipe" in your bag? im sure what and how was legal i just think it was heavy handed. would they not have had to suspect him of terrrism or somehing?could they have traced something from his computer beforehand?

[ChesterPFX]

could they have traced something from his computer beforehand?

Why, was there something on there that they would be interested in?

but are you allowed "sulphur and a pipe" in your bag?

Didn't have a 'pipe' though did he. You told us it was an air gun barrel.

if theres details you want to know il find them out for you.

Why don't you find out what he was actually arrested for. That might give you a bit of a clue as to why it happened to him.

[blueflame]

Are we sure we have all the facts here? I do not know any PC's (and I know a fair few I assure you) who would have the first clue what chemicals are used in explosives compounds, let alone recognise them.
On his arrest he would have been booked in and a parent or guardian contacted to act as an appropriate adult. If they could no be contacted, the local council social services would have been contacted and a social worker would have come to the station to ensure the well-being of your friend. He would have also been given the option of legal advice, which if he didn't have his own solicitor, would have been provided free.
His house may well have been searched if a Sec 18 had been authorised. If they had wanted his hard drive then it would have been removed and taken to be forensically examined by an HTU.
Kept in custody for 24 hrs? Only if authorised by the duty officer for the first 2 reviews, then the next review has to be conducted by an officer who is either a Superintendant or above. Happen often? No.

I would treat your story with a degree of scepticism I'm afraid. It would appear you have an issue with the old bill which might not be a great idea if you ever seek a CoER.

hey chesterpfx your a funny guy, your reply tickled me,i wouldnt want to argue a point with you thats for sure. have a virtual drink on me.

Edited by blueflame, 08 March 2005 - 10:14 PM.

[cunning_plan]

he was arrested for having the stuff with him. the air rifle barrel was by the police counted as materials for a pipe b**b. on the subject of info on the computer...surely this forum woud make the police scepticle enough?

[Richard H]

We believe transparency is the best policy. We want to demonstrate that we are safe and sane enthusiasts who appreciate the art, skill, and science of pyrotechny. We (the moderating team) police this forum ourselves. Self-regulation is the way forward!

[blueflame]

Self-regulation is the way forward!

to change the subject a touch but still on the same theme,
as the owner of a 1000 cc high powered sports motorcycle that could reach speeds close to that of 200 mph yet i have no intention of ever doing anything near that on a public road i also believe self regulation is the way forward, jap motorcycle manufactures also believe this is the way forward and have started to restrict power output a tad with out the law getting involved.

as you were.

[Andrew]

to change the subject a touch but still on the same theme,
as the owner of a 1000 cc high powered sports motorcycle that could reach speeds close to that of 200 mph yet i have no intention of ever doing anything near that on a public road i also believe self regulation is the way forward, jap motorcycle manufactures also believe this is the way forward and have started to restrict power output a tad with out the law getting involved.

as you were.

Motorcycles seem to be another endangered species at the moment, I'm sure you are aware of the "quite" bill that is being put together at the moment. The gov think that motorcycles are too dangerous for the roads and want to ban them.

Pyro could suffer the same fate, laws being passed without anyone knowing it was done. I'm sure everyone knows about the calls to ban all air rifles. One disgruntled parent is leading the way into the Nanny State with NO consideration for others. She says, like my partner, there is no need for them. Buses kill more people than air rifles, I'm sure they would not like it if I said there is NO need for them, you can walk to work, it makes it a safer place. Perhaps the gov should ban all air travel, if a plane were to land on a populated area, which it has before, there would be many dead people.

It all depends on where the anger and hate is placed. It is propaganda at it's worst. The hate of air rifles has been extended to anyone that owns or sells them, the media and the cries of one person have I?m sure, caused many an argument. Every person that owns an air rifle has been turned into a demon, a yob, a danger to the public, and it is wrong. Pyro will suffer the same fate if an MP?s child, or an editor?s friends child, gets killed or injured by a stray firework or the work of an idiot.

Does anyone remember when pistols were outlawed? The laws were passed through gov quickly to avoid intense opposition from gun clubs and organisations. It is often the case where the few ruin the enjoyment of the many. It is wrong that one bad experience should damage future enjoyment. A bleak and pessimistic outlook I know, but things can be done to prevent any such action being taken against amateur ?pyroartists?.

[broadsword]

Perhaps the gov should ban all air travel, if a plane were to land on a populated area, which it has before, there would be many dead people.

[off topic] Did you know that statistically your more likely to be killed by your trousers than in a plane crash!
[/off topic]

[Andrew]

maybe they should make everyone go around in skirts

The royal society for the prevention of accidents produces some pretty funny stats, just like killer trousers.