43 replies to this topic

[Andrew]

I did not say that he should have kept 0.5M nitric acid. H2SO4 is used at 98% concentration for nitroglycerin I believe. HNO3 can be 60%+. For say, making Ba(NO3)2, 30% HNO3 could easily be used. 60% could even react too quickly.

You actually use around 0.5M to 1M solution for this reaction it's a lot safer than 30% which is considered concentrated.

The very dangerous part is diluting the acid, this is a very exothermic process and usually you add acid to water not the other way round.

I never said anything about the safety.

No but you were being condescending and cynical. Something that certainly does not come across as constructive, nor does is it do any good for the content of any forum.

I do not know anyone who walks past dying people. (Unless there's a risk to their own life). I have been taught first aid in school. I have also learned some out of school.

I have tended to an epileptic person before on a busy tube platform, of which I had to walk half way across to get to them. Everyone was more concerned with getting to work on time and they though he was drunk so didn't want sick on their shoes! Not one of them gave a toss that some poor block was having a fit. Believe me there are a lot of people out there like that. They all looked at him is the most vulgar fashion, and then took offence when I asked them to get back, one of the tos*ers even argued with me saying, ?can?t you just drag him out of the way, the train is due any minute??. There really a lot of people that don?t care about anything but themselves, do not kid yourself, we live in the real world.

It's very good that you were taught something, and took the initiative to learn more, its very commendable.

[sarcasm]
1st "reason". Some guitars are sprayed with NC lacquer to make them shiny.
2nd "reason". Ahh! NC is used to fire bullets! It's an explosive! It's killed people! It's used in fireworks!

Ban Guitars! [/sarcasm]

The point I was making is that you cannot make these sorts of analogies and comparisons. In PyromaniaMan?s case you ticked him off for having conc acids, rhetorically accusing him of owning them solely for the manufacture of HE.

98% Sulphuric acid is the most concentrated it can get before you go into the realms of oleum. There is nothing special about it. It is not solely used for the manufacture of HE and it is not the only way to manufacture HE. You can use many concentrations much lower than 18.4M to make nitronium ions, and thus nitrate organic material. You do not need it to be that concentrated. The real question is why not have 98%, I?d be more worries if it was a very specific concentration, which does have only one or two uses. I have half a litre of D2O in the shed, and next to it is some Lithium Carbonate, it doesn?t mean I make H-b*mbs at the weekend though does it?

I say well done for using your brains PyromaniaMan. I would have liked to have asked some technical questions about the dosage, but it?s a shame he does not post here anymore. Instead there was a load of hype. There?s no need for it!

[fishy1]

"The very dangerous part is diluting the acid, this is a very exothermic process and usually you add acid to water not the other way round."
Yes, or the water/acid boils, and acids goes everywhere. That's an important tip.

"No but you were being condescending and cynical. Something that certainly does not come across as constructive, nor does is it do any good for the content of any forum."

Sorry, I wasn't intending to take away from the fact he saved this guys life.

"I have tended to an epileptic person before on a busy tube platform, of which I had to walk half way across to get to them. Everyone was more concerned with getting to work on time and they though he was drunk so didn't want sick on their shoes! Not one of them gave a toss that some poor block was having a fit. Believe me there are a lot of people out there like that. They all looked at him is the most vulgar fashion, and then took offence when I asked them to get back, one of the tos*ers even argued with me saying, ?can?t you just drag him out of the way, the train is due any minute??. There really a lot of people that don?t care about anything but themselves, do not kid yourself, we live in the real world.

It's very good that you were taught something, and took the initiative to learn more, its very commendable."

Good for you.



" I have half a litre of D2O in the shed, and next to it is some Lithium Carbonate, it doesn?t mean I make H-b*mbs at the weekend though does it?"

Lol.

"I say well done for using your brains PyromaniaMan. I would have liked to have asked some technical questions about the dosage, but it?s a shame he does not post here anymore. Instead there was a load of hype. There?s no need for it!"

"Neutralise it? I din't even have the time to isolate it- I just had to syringe off about a ml and wipe it on his tongue - washed down with water and antacid from next to the coldpack."

I think he might still be posting here, he replied.(I)


I really didn't post this post very well, and well done to the guy for saving his life.

[BigG]

http://mail.google.c...0aad8b896f1a04f
There ya go don't know how long it'll be there.

This is a mail protected post, so no-one can see it anyway.

Nonetheless, I find this story almost too good to be true. Unless you can provide some solid proof that this act has actually happened, I find it rather bogus looking.

Of course, if it is true, then you have nothing but my deepest admirations.

At the same opportunity, I would ask that you would retain from making it a case for discussing HE (for which you already been warned in the past), or pass on your account. Passing on accounts is not allowed on this forum. If someone else want an account, they need to register.

[Stuart]

No it really is not. They used to make snooker balls out of Nitro Cellulose, they exploded occasionally, but it was the only plastic at the time that was any good. NC has hundreds of applications these days; in fact a form of nitrated cellulose is used to make a sustainable clear plastic for sandwich packaging. NG is used for a variety of purposes, less than NC because it is not as useful, its medicinal benefits are well documented.

Is it really that difficult to accept that there are other uses for just about every thing. Ricin, nasty poison yeah, well that is used in medicine as well, all poisons are drugs, all drugs when dosed correctly provide a form of treatment.

I think you miss understood why I said 'Is this a joke?'. I know for well that NG is used as a vasodilator and that explosives have more uses than just destruction. Believe it or not, I would describe myself as an open minded person, and if I didn't know anything about NG, and someone told me that it was used in medicine, my reply would be 'How?', not 'What Ever'.

The reason I said 'Is this a joke?', is as Alany and BigG pointed out. Someone complained of chest pains, and in the period of half an hour, he had got onto his computer, looked into the symptoms, read the NG article, which is quite sizable, got a synth, went into his lab, whipped up a Nitration bath, slapped some Glycerine in, leave it for a bit, syphoned it off and administered it all in good time where if he hadn't, the person could have died.

VERY far fetched, would you not say? But I guess it could have happened, at a push.

Edited by Stuart, 18 April 2006 - 06:14 PM.

[Andrew]

fair play stuart.

[Mumbles]

The headache can come just from the fumes. The headache is brutal as well, so I have heard.

I have a very hard time believing this. It must not have been a very serious heart attack if he was still able to survive for 30 minutes. At very, and I mean very, best case scenario, looking up the symptoms, finding the synth, and making even a test tube quantity would take 20 minutes*. If he was able to last for those 20 minutes without serious physiological damage, it probably wasn't even worthy of needing vasodililators.

* - that 20 minutes is for me, where I know exactly where the info I want is located, and how to do the nitration as fast as possible.

Edited by BigG, 19 April 2006 - 08:10 AM.

[Andrew]

Many people?s heart attacks last for hours, just because you are having a heart attack it does not mean your heat stops pumping blood round the body. In the majority of cases (early on when the victim does not know he/she has a heart condition) they liken it to f*ck off bad heart burn/indigestion, it often passes within 30mins or so for mild cases. The heart sorts it self out eventually, but this is the place for the NG spray, it stops it immediately. It is, contrary to popular believe, quite rare for someone to go, "ughh", grip their chest and keel over dead. There are millions of people that suffer from myocardial infarctions, but cardiac arrest, although more likely for people who have a history of angina, caused by ventricular fibrillation is rare compared to the number of mild heart attacks.

[EnigmaticBiker]

Odd controversial thread, so I thought I'd chip in with the medical data.

Getting the dosage correct for such a chemical might be a bit difficult and risky.

Here's some dosage data:-

IV administration, max dose 400 micrograms.

Inhalation, as spray, usually 0.4-0.8 mg max 1.2mg.

Oral, as 1,2,3 and 5mg tablets to be slowly dissolved in the mouth. 5mg only used in unresponsive cases

(from pharma data sheets)

[Andrew]

NG sprays are applied under the tongue.

I didn't know you could get inhalors as well.


Useful data EnigmaticBiker.

[EnigmaticBiker]

NG sprays are applied under the tongue.

I didn't know you could get inhalors as well.
Useful data EnigmaticBiker.

You're correct, it's a spray rather than inhalor.

There are patches as well.

[fishy1]

There are patches as well.

Yep, as I mentioned earlier in the thread, it's used in patches as a preventative.