29 replies to this topic

[Spudgun]

Quoting MSER commentary:
This is one area where I believe the UKPS needs to campaign for some relief for hobbyists in the form of an exemption from the HSE. We can only have a hope and a prayer of doing this if we have a large and representative membership. The best thing you can do right now is join the society, come to our events, and lend your support to the cause.

I wish I could im under 18 though. Hopefully someone will do the campaigning for me till I 'come of age'

[sizzle]

I wish I could im under 18 though. Hopefully someone will do the campaigning for me till I 'come of age'

You can join the society under 18.... The Junior membership is available, go to pyrosociety.org.uk for more info.

[Spudgun]

none of the links work except join us and events...

[sizzle]

none of the links work except join us and events...

The site isn't finished yet, if you click Join Us and fill in the form, you will get a membership form with the details on.

[adam]

Hi, I will never dream of making 50g or more BP at one time for my roman candle displays, however (as I study economics ) I bought in “economies of scale” (allot of the chemicals needed as it is cheaper that way). To be honest I have enough Potassium nitrate + sulphur + charcole to make around 400g. Will this be seen as dodgy with the police? I also have 200g aluminium shavings for flashes etc + i am only 16.

By the way I am most defiantly not having a go at the police, I really respect the work they are doing in order to keep us safe from idiots, I am just scared of being seen as one of the bad guys.

Adam

[pyromaniac303]

Hi, I will never dream of making 50g or more BP at one time for my roman candle displays, however (as I study economics ) I bought in “economies of scale” (allot of the chemicals needed as it is cheaper that way). To be honest I have enough Potassium nitrate + sulphur + charcole to make around 400g. Will this be seen as dodgy with the police? I also have 200g aluminium shavings for flashes etc + i am only 16.

I doubt they would pay too much attention, after all, a lot of the members of this forum have a large chemical selection equalling maybe 10+kgs of chemicals. As long as your not storing your home made BP for longer than neccesary, and don't attract any attention (make sure your neighbours are happy with what you are doing, etc) then they don't have any grounds to arrest you.

Edited by pyromaniac303, 16 November 2006 - 12:39 PM.

[BigG]

As I understand it, you may not store it for any appreciable length of time, and that by the completion of the trial/experiment no explosive remains to be stored. Schedule 1 of the Control of Explosives Regulations lists exempt items for which a license to acquire or acquire and keep explosives is not required. Black powder is NOT on Schedule 1, therefore in order to keep the 100g of black powder you have manufactured legally under MSER, you will need an acquire & keep certificate issued by your local Police force. Whether or not the Police would grant you such a certificate is another matter.

Quoting MSER commentary:
This is one area where I believe the UKPS needs to campaign for some relief for hobbyists in the form of an exemption from the HSE. We can only have a hope and a prayer of doing this if we have a large and representative membership. The best thing you can do right now is join the society, come to our events, and lend your support to the cause.

Richard - I think you got it wrong there. The Control of Explosive Regulations does not talk about things that are manufactures but only things you acquire. The idea is that is you ACQUIRE black power then you need a storage certificate. If you manufacture it - then this specific act does not hold.

At first it looks a bit strange - but I can see logic to it. It allows higher education institutions and research lab to work with small fuel / oxidizer mixture without needing to be concerned about the law.

If you buy a pyrotechnic article / composition , then the element of experimentation is not there, and you have to justify the reason for the purchase by means of applying to a license.

The acquire and keep rules are specifically referring to items who have UN number.

I could be wrong. I must admit I have not reviewed the laws for a while now – been to busy with all the society plans and build ups – but I will look at it when we get to the item relating to the publication of simple legal definitions for the hobbyist community. What number is it on the list? 27 or something L. The links on the site should be working now, for the members who could not get them to work. Good Night.

Edited by BigG, 16 November 2006 - 12:26 AM.

[adam]

Good stuff. Thanks.

Adam

[Richard H]

The law as it stands has no requirement on who may manufacture. Be that an individual, or an educational establishment, and so on.

The fact is, if you want to mix more than 100g of composition, you need a licensed factory regardless of who you are.

[hoarp001]

I have 150g of un milled powder, just the ingreediants mixed up ready to mill... Does this count as black powder when it is unmilled?

Thanks.

Edited by hoarp001, 26 November 2006 - 06:22 PM.

[BigG]

I have 150g of un milled powder, just the ingreediants mixed up ready to mill... Does this count as black powder when it is unmilled?

Thanks.

Well, it's called green mix by everyone - and I think that even by law - if it's not intimately mixed - if is not called black powder. It might be considered an explosive – and then you are just outside of what the law allows.

[PyroKingdom]

If your interested the relivant part of the new laws (MSER 2005), is as follows;

PART 3

LICENSING AND REGISTRATION REQUIREMENTS

Explosives not to be manufactured without a licence[/b]
9. - (1) Subject to paragraph (2), no person shall manufacture explosives unless he holds a licence for that manufacture and complies with the conditions of that licence.

(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to -

(a) the manufacture of explosives for the purpose of laboratory analysis, testing, demonstration or experimentation (but not for practical use or sale) where the total quantity of explosives being manufactured at any time does not exceed 100 grams, but nothing in this sub-paragraph shall be taken as authorising any acquisition or keeping of explosives for which an explosives certificate is required by virtue of regulation 7 of those Regulations, without such a certificate;


The bits in red are the most relevant parts.
The laws added to the statute continue for some considerable pages.


In lay terms, as already stated, you can make upto 100g for the practices associated with parts of this forum. Note that "practical use" includes use in a display, so makeing a device and setting it off in a safe manor is fine, showing it to friends is not (well a debateably grey area anyway, but I would not want to be the one to find out where a judge thinks the line lies!!!).


(EDIT: spelling mistake; probably more!)

 

i cant find the MSR 2005 law on this can you post a link please

[PyroKingdom]

wait so does the 100g rule mean i can make black powder without a liscence as long as its 100g or less?

[rocketpro]

That`s a 2006 post. But the answer is you need a police certificate.

Edited by rocketpro, 15 November 2014 - 05:23 PM.