25 replies to this topic

[Mick]

Hi !

I have to realise bullet hits on trees .
I often use D-80 series as boddy hits but is SD or D60 more appropriate on objects?
What size will give me the best effects ? ( Bullets comme from beretta 92 and glock 17).

Can you share your experience on this effects ?

Thank you

Edited by Mick, 10 January 2007 - 06:07 PM.

[barra69]

I know the film industry likes to have 'bullet strikes' as highly visible, however most rounds fired into trees have no visible effect. This is especially true of the calibres you are suggesting. If you want to be realistic you do not need to show any explosion of material from the trees. As a matter of interest the same is true of strikes into most other material other than water, mud, sand and dust.

[Mick]

I know the film industry likes to have 'bullet strikes' as highly visible, however most rounds fired into trees have no visible effect. This is especially true of the calibres you are suggesting. If you want to be realistic you do not need to show any explosion of material from the trees. As a matter of interest the same is true of strikes into most other material other than water, mud, sand and dust.

I agree with that , but you know many directors want to everithing "blow up" !!

Somebody can help me and say me what is the particularity of each series ?

[Mick]

Nobody can help me about the different use of each series ? ( D60,D80, SD, MD)

[ProfHawking]

I dont think many of us here are involved in film special effects. Im sure some people could help you with the series, but i cant.

What I would say is that if bullets striking trees is an effect you want, then maybe you could try drilling half an inch or so into the surface of the tree/bark, and put a charge inside, so that when it goes off, the wood is splintered and blown outwards in a small area. And you maybe could rig some small branches to 'break'.
I think that would be more realistic than the whole place doused in petrol or whatever your director wants...
Or is that awful cruelty to trees?

[Richard H]

Rob, you're a bad man. The tree huggers are going to come and kill you!

[delta_echo]

I've always just used small amounts of 70/30 flash encased in small tubes with a electric match attached. They are great for ground hits and body hits (with a blood pack attached and the appropriate safety measures), but not so much on tree hits due to the telltale flash. The quick remedy for this is simply just to cut a frame out during editing, however. Ideally I would like to eliminate the flash all together, but without the heavy smoke produced by other compositions.

Any idea as to the formulation of the professional "bullet hits" that you are using? Do they produce much smoke or flash? Not trying to change the subject, but I am curious.

[ProfHawking]

does anyone know what xmas cracker snaps are made with? if you strip them to the actual snap part, its very small, and goes pop without confinement, and also doesn't seem to make much flash or smoke. might be handy for this kinda thing.

Also, trees have it coming! Think of all the kids that have fallen out of one, its just a little bit of revenge

[Mumbles]

They are generally some sort of high explosive mix. Usually silver fulminate IIRC. I've also heard the possibility of armstrong's mix.

[adamw]

Mick

Sorry about the lack of reply, I've had other things on my mind.

A MD-1 perhaps? This would be easier to insert because of it's cylindrical shape and could be used to blow off small branches. If you want the hit in the body of the tree it's self, I would be tempted to drill from the back (if it's fairly thin) and plug it. Otherwise, if you have the choice of trees, maybe peel back some loose bark, make a cavity for your MD-1 in the actual 'wood' and then re-cover it with the bark.

[dave]

quote name='adamw' date='Jan 19 2007, 02:25 PM' post='30622']
Mick

Sorry about the lack of reply, I've had other things on my mind.

A MD-1 perhaps? This would be easier to insert because of it's cylindrical shape and could be used to blow off small branches. If you want the hit in the body of the tree it's self, I would be tempted to drill from the back (if it's fairly thin) and plug it. Otherwise, if you have the choice of trees, maybe peel back some loose bark, make a cavity for your MD-1 in the actual 'wood' and then re-cover it with the bark.
[/quote]

the bullet hits in question used to be made by de la mare engineering, in san fernado, usa.
are they available in the uk ?
some bullet hits i believe use a lead thiocyanate/chlorate mix, although lead is becomming more of an issue i understand

ds

[YT2095]

does anyone know what xmas cracker snaps are made with? if you strip them to the actual snap part, its very small, and goes pop without confinement, and also doesn't seem to make much flash or smoke. might be handy for this kinda thing.

it`s Armstrongs mix and a binder, trust me, you do NOT want to mess about with this stuff!

[YT2095]

They are generally some sort of high explosive mix. Usually silver fulminate IIRC. I've also heard the possibility of armstrong's mix.

Silver fulminate is Insane! and also responsible for many lives lost each year in the manufacture of these "Snaps" or "Devil Bangers".
this is NOT used in Any commercial product other than these things and for good reason.
the compound is also of little to no Scientific value either.

[Arthur Brown]

In the UK Bullet hits can be simulated by a microdet inserted in a hole drilled through the tree. The problems include hiding the wire and drilling holes in thick trees -Oh! and the fact that you will kill a tree for each one drilled so your location manager will have some details to attend to -or bills to pay!

If you want bullet hits in a tree bigger than 4 inches thick the cost of a lost timber tree or worse a lost parkland specimen tree will justify using CGI or closeup shots of the bullet hit in a fallen timber log.

Filming like theatre is "suspended disbelief" The "Office" by the Thames wasn't really exploded for that Bond film but the film showed it's destruction! Bullet hits in films are often put in in the editing stage -one of my friends used to put the hits in the early bond films, sitting on a chair in an edit suite! -no pyro involved.

Edited by Arthur Brown, 10 February 2008 - 09:26 AM.

[Steelrat]

Bullet hits in close up on the Bark of a tree using D80/2 s

re-creating 38 special bullet hit , drilled hole, filled with sawdust and talc, covered with masking tape sprayed to match the tree bark, then dusted with dirt to hide any diffrence between colours
then fired via remote detonator box.