7 replies to this topic

[phillmypintpot]

Hi there, are there any chemists out there who can help me?

I recently performed an electrolysis experiment with a copper anode and cathode, the electrolyte I used was a relatively concentrated ammonium nitrate solution. I had 24v at about 2 amps going through the cell.

My observations were firstly a strong smell of ammonia, secondly the solution turned a bright blue transparent colour, thirdly an opaque light blue/green solid forming at the cathode, finally copper particles forming at the anode.

I allowed the cell to run for 48 hours and topped the electrolyte up with water at regular intervals.

I filtered the contents of the cell. The filtrate was bright blue (copper nitrate solution?) The filtrand was an opaque light greeen/blue.

Any ideas? (i) what I have? (ii) is it of any use?

Thanks, Phill.

Edited by phillmypintpot, 22 September 2007 - 02:07 PM.

[YT2095]

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NEVER put Copper in AN! EVER!

it makes tetramine copper (II) Nitrate, an Explosive!

pour it all away NOW!

[phillmypintpot]

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NEVER put Copper in AN! EVER!

it makes tetramine copper (II) Nitrate, an Explosive!

pour it all away NOW!

Eek!!!!!!

Is that the filtrate, or the filtrand? I presume the filtrate.

Is it safe in solution, or is it dangerous in any state?

Many thanks for looking out for me, I am deeply appreciative. I'll take it as a lesson learned & seek advice first before any more kwackery.

In my defence, I did try to google it first and really couldn't find any information and I searched for about 2 hours. I suppose I didn't ask the right question!

[phillmypintpot]

I've just Googled tetramine copper II nitrate and it looks like I could have unwittingly made some, however it is the crystals that present the danger, not the solution. I'm really glad I didn't get any ideas about evaporating it out of solution.

Ironically, it's amazing how many people out there are trying to make it, it appears to be one of those things that are difficult to make if you are trying.

I appear to have discovered what the filtrand is - copper hydroxide, so it's not all bad!

I've had my fingers burned now, metaphorically speaking, so no more experiments without thorough research first!!

Just one more question, what's the most environmentally friendly way to dispose of tetramine copper II nitrate solution?

[YT2095]

well I`m not going into any details about what part is and is not safe as that`s a recipe by default, fact is you should dissolve ALL of it and dispose of it ASAP.

I know, and I read it as you made a mistake, and happily you have your fingers left on your hands and the Law hasn`t knocked on your door, they will Not see it that way!.

if you want to be Mega safe, throw in a strong soln of NaOH and then dump it.

edit: and don`t feel bad, I used to use it as a cheap and nasty PCB etchant before I found out!

Edited by YT2095, 22 September 2007 - 02:11 PM.

[phillmypintpot]

if you want to be Mega safe, throw in a strong soln of NaOH and then dump it.

Many thanks, I've got some NaOH kicking about, I might even earn some brownie points from 'her' for cleaning the drains if I make it concentrated enough

[Mumbles]

I agree, hydroxide is by far the safest way to dispose of it. There may be some nasty smells of ammonia eminating though. Might want to add the NaOH in the backyard or porch or something.

If it makes you feel any better, Tetraamine Copper (II) Nitrate (TACN) is only sriously dangerous as an explosive in solid form. It's quite hydroscopic as well, so I think you would have encountered some difficulties, should you have made the unfortunate choice to try to dry it out. Forming TACN is a fairly common laboratory demonstration of Tetraamine Copper salts, and the beautiful blue color it makes.

[YT2095]

TACS (the Sulphate analog) is the safest and just as, if not more vivid a color as the others. although it`s only stable in soln AFAIK, attempts to crystalise it fail.

Copper Acetate makes beautiful crystals though! quite large too