272 replies to this topic

[fishy1]

sigh...


i was talking about doing it the real mans way, with a hacksaw.

1/2" brass rod ain't too thick, cutting 1" stuff might take 3 times as long. that's a good idea about the vice.

me, i'm gonna try casting some lead in copper pipe tomorrow, could be fun, might run the furnace.

[FrankRizzo]

Fishy1,

I tried the lead in copper pipe tek (ala Passfire) last weekend with only limited success. I cut a 5' length of copper pipe into 6" sections. Of the 10 sections, only 8 released the lead the first time, and the number of good pipes dwindled down to 2 after only two casting runs. All told, I was only able to make 17 bars of the 25 that I had wanted to make.

The wooden dowel idea only works if the lead comes out easily. If the casting gets stuck in the pipe, no amount of hammering on the other end will free it...the lead just mushrooms at the point of contact with the dowel and lodges itself more thoroughly in the tube. Just cut off the portion that you?re able to push out and then use a blowtorch to melt and reclaim the lead out of the tube which is now useless.

I supported the pipe sections in fine, dry, quartz sand (the type used for concrete) while casting, but did not bury them all the way to the top. Approx. 2" suck out of the sand. This may have been what caused my problem as the pipe went through uneven expansion on the insulated (in sand) vs. the portion sticking out into the free air. If I was going to do it again, I'd make sure to bury the pipe in the sand as much as possible to keep from stressing the pipe unevenly.

[alany]

I don't know how Kyle thinks using Copper as a reusable mold for lead is ment to work? Lead will wet Copper quite easily and ruin the mold. The Al-foil around a dowel as a former, then packed in sand works fine, the ugly surface isn't a big deal IMO.

[Stuart]

1/2" brass rod ain't too thick, cutting 1" stuff might take 3 times as long. that's a good idea about the vice.

me, i'm gonna try casting some lead in copper pipe tomorrow, could be fun, might run the furnace.

1" stuff would probably take 2-3 times longer, just means you'll have to cut three times faster

WRT using copper as the mould, why not just get loads of copper pipe, cut it up into 1" tubes, pour the lead into it, and use it as the media? This was actually one of the first types of media I used, and has a few advantages to straight lead.

• Although copper is quite soft too, it will still provide some extra protection for the media, so it will last longer
• Its a good mould itself, no need to fiddle around with special moulding kits or filling wood with holes. Plus, you don't need to worry about getting the lead out of the mould
• Less lead contamination, as only the ends are exposed

However, sometimes the lead can pop out of the copper, so maybe taking a hammer to the end of each piece and giving it a bit of a lip might stop this. Also, I recall some people mentioning that copper pipe can contain hidden extras, that could cause sparking.

Edited by Stuart, 29 April 2006 - 07:40 AM.

[alany]

If you use a pipe-cutter it will close the ends a little and retain the lead.

However, the jacket will eventually split and delaminate from the lead unless it was wetted by the lead really well. You can flux the copper and add a bit of tin to the lead and it will wet the copper better.

[Stuart]

When I made the copper/lead media, the pipe was cut using a pipe cutter. It did leave a lip, but some of the lead still came out after a few milling sessions. It is not necessary to put your own lip on, as the lead only came out with a few media, but they will eventually all come out I should think will lots of heavy milling.

[fishy1]

1" stuff would probably take 2-3 times longer, just means you'll have to cut three times faster

WRT using copper as the mould, why not just get loads of copper pipe, cut it up into 1" tubes, pour the lead into it, and use it as the media? This was actually one of the first types of media I used, and has a few advantages to straight lead.

• Although copper is quite soft too, it will still provide some extra protection for the media, so it will last longer
• Its a good mould itself, no need to fiddle around with special moulding kits or filling wood with holes. Plus, you don't need to worry about getting the lead out of the mould
• Less lead contamination, as only the ends are exposed

However, sometimes the lead can pop out of the copper, so maybe taking a hammer to the end of each piece and giving it a bit of a lip might stop this. Also, I recall some people mentioning that copper pipe can contain hidden extras, that could cause sparking.

that's actually what I meant. I plan to get the copper pipe nice and hot, and pour the lead down it. I had a similar idea for keeping the lead in, thanks for that.

[Phoenix]

Having cast a load of lead media (in holes bored through a plank, I think I've described it in a post from a while back) and cut up a load of brass media (by hand) I'd say the latter was definitely easier and quicker, never mind healthier.

[pyromaniac303]

Would you say these are suitable for milling media?

fishing weights

I bought them anyway, and I will find some other use if not, but I am thinking of buying a rock tumbler to go with them from a place in Tideswell, Derbyshire

[Andrew]

Fishing weights are just normal lead, you need hardened lead for milling, fishing b*mbs (lol, how rediculas, that word again, even though it is completely out of context) are not that suitable.

They will work, but eventually they will just be a source of contamination. If you are going to use them, I would remove the trace eyes; these could make unwanted sparks.

[pyromaniac303]

Ok, thanks for the advice. I will cut the eyes off with some wire cutters and I was thinking of getting a 3lb max weight rock tumbler.

What is a typical amount of milling media? I think 20 doesnt really sound a lot, but don't want to overload my ball mill and cause damage (I am buying a couple of spare belts anyway just in case).

Also I am not sure what sort of weight of BP to make, maybe I could buy some extra weights if you think it would be a good idea.

I might buy some ceramic non sparking media from inoxia next time I put in an order, which will probably be a long time because I have a lot of their 1/2" tubes left, and I will use those up first.

[fishy1]

Ok, thanks for the advice. I will cut the eyes off with some wire cutters and I was thinking of getting a 3lb max weight rock tumbler.

What is a typical amount of milling media? I think 20 doesnt really sound a lot, but don't want to overload my ball mill and cause damage (I am buying a couple of spare belts anyway just in case).

Also I am not sure what sort of weight of BP to make, maybe I could buy some extra weights if you think it would be a good idea.

I might buy some ceramic non sparking media from inoxia next time I put in an order, which will probably be a long time because I have a lot of their 1/2" tubes left, and I will use those up first.

it depends on 2 things: size of media and volume of mill.
I use 100 1 onze(spelling is wrong, 1/16 of a lb) leads in my ball mill.

100g BP is fine to make at a time if you're not making huge shells. Thinking about it, if your mill takes 24 hours to mill (not a fast mill), you can easy churn out 500g BP a week, enough for most purposes.

Edited by fishy1, 01 May 2006 - 09:26 PM.

[Mumbles]

"Dirty" copper is less susceptable to be bound to by lead in my experience. To solder anything to copper, I've always had to clean it well. Perhaps just heating the tubes on the fire a bit to create an oxide layer on the interior would be of some use.

[alany]

That's true, I use the same trick to make muffin pans scaly enough to cast Aluminium into.

[FrankRizzo]

The problems that I had with the lead sticking in the pipe weren't due to it being wetted by the lead. I could push approx. half of the lead rod out of the tube and then it would bind on a spot where the pipe had evidently changed dimensions enough to cause problems. I was also using the cheaper (read: thinner) copper water pipe ($7 for 5'), so a thicker pipe might work fine.