29 replies to this topic

[Stuart]

If you put fuse in the machine and then wrap it with paper (like newspaper,it needs to be light), you can make some mini serpents. They are nice


Stuart

[adamw]

Some good ideas generated. I still think you can forget about spolettes, but the machine may have uses making other propelled devices. Remember to periodically inspect the inside of the 'machine' to make sure a mass of spilled powder does'nt accumulate.

[Stuart]

I have renamed the thread to a more appropriate name

Stuart

[Phoenix]

I've been having another look at this expedient spolette idea, and I have found a method that so far looks promising, and is much faster than ramming. It's probably of no interest to people with easy access to time fuse or similar, but for me, it's just what I need for small (probably <25mm) insert shells. I never did get a cigarette-rolling machine, but this fits in this topic quite well. Here is the procedure:

1. Dry roll a small tube from a few turns of moderately thick paper. I have been using a 4mm brass rod as the former, and 10.5cm x 15cm (1/4 of a sheet) of thick A4 paper. I made the 15cm edge the length of the tube. I don?t know the weight but it is thicker than the normal 80gsm. Newspaper is easier to roll, but does not work very well for reasons explained later.

2. Without applying glue, remove the tube from the former. Keep it from unrolling in your hand. Using another tube as a sleeve to hold it would probably make this easier, but I haven't tried that yet, as I only thought of it after I read DW's sparkler page.

3. Make a light closure at the bottom of the tube. I folded the sides in.

4. Now use a funnel and wire fill the tube with meal BP. It does not need to be compacted at all. Initially, I did this by tapping the funnel to cause the powder to fall in, but later found this to be unsuitable as it means the powder at the bottom of the tube spends longer getting jarred by the tapping, and ends up denser by the time you have finished. This leads to inconsistent burn rates.

5. Close the top as in 3.

6. Now put this loose tube of BP on a flat surface with a little friction to it - I used a bit of MDF, and begin to roll it by hand, in the same way as you do to tighten a tube, which is of course exactly what you are doing, right onto your BP core. Don't press too hard at first, or the tube will just deform.

7. Once you have tightened it a bit like this, and it is a bit more robust, put another board on top and roll it between the two boards to tighten it more effectively than you can by hand. If you try to use the board straight away the tube just flattens and generally goes wrong.

7. After you've been rolling for a while the spolette should be noticeably thinner, and will have become much harder.

9. Once it's as tight as you think it's going to get (this usually took about 5 or 6 20cm long rolls), glue down the edge of the paper and give it a final roll to set it in place.

10. Once dry, it can be cut to size with a very sharp knife or razor blade. Hopefully, the cross section will look like a paper tube, with a BP core. However, what tended to happen with thinner paper was that the BP migrated behind the inner layer of paper, and the result was a spiral of paper with BP between the layers. This often resulted in an uneven burn rate, and even skipping sections. However, using thicker paper prevents this, as the paper's tendency to push outwards against the tube walls seals the powder in the core of the tube.

I have test burned several lengths of this fuse, and all of those made by the above ?right? method, with a clearly defined core and walls, behaved exactly as one would hope. The burning rate is about 1cm/s. I have tested a 25mm shell using a 1.5cm length of this fuse, and it worked fine. However, I would not want to use this fuse on anything larger than this. This isn?t really a problem, as I?m not going to use so many larger shells, and ramming proper spolettes for them won?t be a problem. However, I believe this will be very useful for cake inserts, and possibly shell inserts, where larger numbers of small diameter spolettes will be needed.

[Stuart]

Interesting. I have also been experimenting and have found that the cigarette roller is good for making the tube for the spollette. You put a thin stick (I use 3mm I think) and then roll paper on top of it. Also, it is easier to roll a small spollette with a bit of paper about 1cm-2cm wide. You then ram your BP into that. I have found that these burn a lot longer than if you just put the paper in, BP and then roll it up.

Stuart

[Phoenix]

Presumably that would be dry rolled though? I don't really find rolling spolette tubes to be a problem, and I prefer to wet roll them.

For my 40mm shells and upwards I use 5mm spolettes, which don't take too long to make (since you can ram a greater depth of powder in one go), and aren't difficult to handle. However, for 1/2" shells and less (which I use for cake and shell inserts) there is a chance that a 5mm spolette would allow the burst to jet out of it, leading to no break or a weak one. Previously, I have used pasted visco as an improvised timefuse, but I'd much rather use something I can make myself.

Whist the 5mm ID spolettes could probably be used for 15mm and upwards shells, makeing 50 of them for a cake would take a very long time - too long. However, for small shells like this, I think this time fuse substitute should be OK.

Edited by Phoenix, 07 April 2004 - 08:52 AM.

[Matt]

Phoenix, For cake type insert shells 15mm and under it is easier to make a dry rolled tube of perhaps 2-3 turns of kraft. Then tie off one end, fill it and place a peice of blackmatch in the end then strangle the tube with a clove hitch. Use thick-ish cotton for a longer delay or just wrap 2 or more times around before tying the knot.

-Matt

Oh and why are we trying to find quickie spollettes? not exactly a long proces, should only need 1 ramming cycle for the delay you fellas want.

[Phoenix]

Now that is a good idea, thanks, I'll give it a try tonight.

I tend to need 3 or more ramming cycles per spolette, guesss I must just have fluffy BP.

[EDIT] I tried the black match method, (on a 15mm shell full of plain BP, as it was still light) and it just quickmatched straight into the shell. I did tie the clove hitch pretty tight, but I'll try the method again with some different match, and see if that helps. OTOH, tried another 15mm BP shell of the same construction with a section of expedient spolette, and really over lifted it and made it very tight in the tube (overkill testing) and it worked great. Looking good for expedient spolettes.

That method of making inserts sure beats cardboard discs for speed, and the seals are stronger too. Nice one, Matt.

Edited by Phoenix, 07 April 2004 - 09:28 PM.

[alany]

I bought myself a cigarette roller yesterday, $6 at the local smoking store, came with papers.

All I can say is WOW! I've been missing out on the single easiest way I've ever tried to make lances, timefuse and fish.

The narrowist can roll a fuse is about 2 mm OD, any smaller and if will pop out from between the rollers. With a custom made machine you might be able to roll chinese fuse with it. It would be handy to make it longer than 65 mm per go too. However, the vanilla tool is very useful.

For timefuse I just roll a 3 mm or so core from meal that has been dampened with spray starch (thanks for that idea Matt, it is wonderfully expedient). I use either cigarette paper or a piece of thin kraft, kitchen wrap, etc, again moistened in spray startch. Once that is nice and tight, I feed in a strip of pasted kraft and roll it up to 6 mm or more. You can start with the kraft alone, but it is more difficult.

The result burns without side-spit at a very stable and repeatable rate.

I tried rolling kraft around a core, bamboo or string first, then rolling meal around that, it works quite well, but takes longer to do and I can't see any advantages. If you wanted to, there is nothing stopping you rolling a water-proof barrier into the fuse too, just like real timefuse.

Meal D granules or colour driver composition (with Ti if you like) works very well for fish, or funky timefuse. Colour composition makes the most expedient lances I've ever made. I tried glitter composition for a pretty nice result, falls composition should work but I haven't tried it yet. A larger machine could roll 1 minute falls cases a whole lot quicker than funnel and wire loading them, and it makes the case in the same step. Killer sparklers and catherine wheels would be easy too if you made your own larger machine. Might work for grasshoppers too, done all dry.

As others have said, you can put a core in there and roll a tube around it. Probably the easiest way to roll ~5 mm ID tubes for crackers. Once you are used to it and have a stack of pasted kraft ready to insert it goes very quickly.

[Stuart]

You can buy from markets (here anyway) novelty size ones that are about 6"-8" long and are made of metal. Will get one sometime and see about nice long time fuse.

[Phoenix]

I bidded on, and won a 24" long one on eBay, for making long lengths of fuse or monster sparklers, but before the seller sent it he got his eBay and Paypal accounts closed for selling assorted drug stuff. I got my money back, at least.

Edited by Phoenix, 05 July 2004 - 12:09 PM.

[The_Djinn]

Can buy online HERE and the prices arnt bad... 6" to 18"

Mark

[Stuart]

Bloody hell, 24". They must have designed them for pyro's. Thanks for the link Djinn, will look into it.

[spawned]

Have you ever thought about stuff like that 'they must have made it for pyros' i mean there must have been a time when everyone has said this............

[lord_dranack]

Just going back to the original spoulette topic, I have just found a simple method for making them in small diameters:
you need to roll them wet for strength, but it can sometimes be hard to roll small tubes straight.
Roll them dry using gum tape, wich incidently is the perfect length for my 3 second delays, and tighten the tube by hand then secure by moistening the end.
Then just soak in water for a few minutes, and they dry rock hard, the perfect sise for smaller shells, made much faster than wet rolling kraft!