130 replies to this topic

[Vic]

Application form here https://eforms.homeo...pp-licence.ofml

Edited by Vic, 29 August 2014 - 08:29 PM.

[dave]

do we have an agreed "reasons for use" ie. suggested wording to use

 

...........pyrotechnic experimentation ? quoting the relevant section in......

[Deano 1]

Why do some suppliers mention acetone in their regulated chems. The amount of businesses that use acetone for cleaning etc, it would cause mayhem.

The list I've seen is this one.

• hydrogen peroxide:12% w/w
• nitromethane: 30% w/w
• nitric acid: 3% w/w
• sodium chlorate: 40% w/w
• potassium chlorate: 40% w/w
• sodium perchlorate: 40% w/w
• potassium perchlorate: 40% w/w

Not a drop of acetone. correct me if I'm wrong.

[Steve]

The guidance to sellers is mostly to do with face to face interaction:

https://www.gov.uk/g...Final_print.pdf

There is next to zero guidance regarding distance selling.

As a seller, there is nothing suspicious about quantity alone, unless you're ordering something like 500kg and delivery is to '2A Basement Flat, etc'.

[MattyJ]

I have started looking at the form this evening and what information I need to get together to apply for a licence. I think a licence for chemicals is well overdue. I hope it makes it easier for like minded people like us to go forward with this hobby.

[Gareth]

Well I just did two things:

1. Submit my application for membership of the UKPS!  Hope I am accepted.

2. Submit my application for an EPP. Hope it's accepted too.

 

Long and a bit of a complex form, I felt like a  potential criminal just filling it in.

Anyway I am no chemist so don't know about all the things listed you have to specify you want.

I only hobby make some pyro stuff "a bit" now and then but really love all things fireworks.  The last thing I did was the usual smoke with plenty of good old tate & lyle!

I was surprised not to see that listed on the banned substances, its dangerous in more ways than one.

No doubt the EU will add that at some point.

Definitely want to try some more experiments but never felt comfy due to legality - this is definitely going in the right direction.

Wanted to do this to ensure that I am totally legal to at least get these chemicals, though at the moment I don't actually have any around.

I have no idea if application will be accepted but I will let you know what happens.

Apparently it takes 28 days to see if I am acceptable.

 

fell foul of the last page as I didn't know that you had to upload details of the counter signatory ident docs so had to re-fill in once I got the driving license number from my mate the next day.

Thought I would have to scan his license but I asked the HO if I need to but you only need to upload counter signatory ident docs if the applicant is under 18.

[Duncanr]

On the subject of the EPP licence, you have to go in person to get your chemicals. The back of the licence will be filled in by the supplier, giving the amounts involved etc. They also need to see that you are the holder of the licence.

 

Duncan

[phildunford]

On the subject of the EPP licence, you have to go in person to get your chemicals. The back of the licence will be filled in by the supplier, giving the amounts involved etc. They also need to see that you are the holder of the licence.

 

Duncan

Yes, this has been discussed at some length.

 

Really changes the whole thing in my opinion,  we are not talking Tescos local here, so it's frankly completely impractical. Our legislation wiz Wayne is going to discuss this with the HO.

 

The only good thing is that there are still a lot of things you can make with chemicals that are not (yet!) effectively banned. Certainly won't be wasting money and time on an application myself, until all is made crystal clear.

[wayne]

Ok all, here's the official line from the HO:

 

"Purchaser to send scanned [or faxed] copy of their licence and accompanying ID to the seller at point of sale. Once the seller has verified these documents they will then need to have an agreement with a courier company for the company to deliver the chemicals to the individual and at point of delivery check the licence and accompanying ID [to ensure they are handing goods to the correct person] and endorse the licence with the details of the transaction."

 

This has been suggested previously.  I guess suppliers are going to have to open talks with couriers but inevitably there will be cost incurred.

 

I still maintain that this really isn't a major problem.  If the time comes when your Chlorate, Perchlorate or barium compound supplies are running low, place an order for a years worth (or whatever you feel practical) and go and collect!  

Edited by wayne, 10 September 2014 - 03:16 PM.

[Arthur Brown]

If I can collect say a year's worth then the licence is fair, if I have to collect 100g at a time .... I certainly want to know where "reasonable" is in terms of purchase for a long period.

[wayne]

If I can collect say a year's worth then the licence is fair, if I have to collect 100g at a time .... I certainly want to know where "reasonable" is in terms of purchase for a long period.

 

Roger, please read some of my previous replies.  I stated numerous times that there has never been any stipulation that 100g was a limit...you're getting the experimental manufacturing regulations (ER 2014) confused with the precursor regulations.

 

A "reasonable" amount is subjective to the individual, it could be 1kg, it could be 10kg, but it doesn't mean stockpiling 500kg is reasonable.  Just use common sense, ie, can I justify the amounts I'm ordering as legitimate stock....

[Gareth]

Just heard from EPP by email, they are processing my license but I accept this is no guarantee of success.

The email states this:

"

Your license is being processed but you should be aware that while this license permits you to purchase (and eventually process and use) various explosives precursors and poisons, it does not replace the requirement for licences to manufacture, acquire or keep explosives.  You should check to ensure you also comply with all the requirements of Heath and Safety Executive explosive legislation.

"

 

Actually this all makes perfect sense, this license is just to give me permission to obtain the chemicals, but these have so many different uses that of course if I create something of an explosive nature with them that is bound to have further regulations applied.

 

This is fine, just means more paperwork I guess.

 

BTW I was very upfront about why I wanted the EPP license, I stated for the use of each chemical "Hobby / Experimental use for pyrotechnics".

[Amergin]

Hello members.......I being more chemistry than pyro make some small shells and small BP rockets (Kit) probably a couple or more times a year for the kids so I'm a novice hobbyist through and through....had a Perchlorate order from my usual supplier stopped just a few days ago and he e-mailed me the new regs.Halloween coming so thought id get my few bits ordered .....cant say im surprised and am fully behind the move to regulate all chemicals with potential to do wrong with... i use the perc mix as a small burst charge atop my little rockets so have replaced it with another chemical ...i never store anything mixed ...I use all on day of making my rockets... unsure about holding "EXPLOSIVES" licence as it sounds very extreme ..... I gulp even when I say " Explosives Licence " ..... anyways great reading the posts from members ...I will mull it over for a few days and email them for their opinion... .....thanks Pete    

Edited by Amergin, 17 September 2014 - 08:56 AM.

[cooperman435]

Its not actually an "explosives licence" Pete, its simply a precursor licence so just enabling you to purchase and store the same things you could before (plus others you couldnt too)

 

COER however if you make as you say BP and flash (in the near future) for the headers is a necessity and I suppose this would be classed fairly as an explosives licence but still doesn't result in you having to store anything and its free :-)

[Amergin]

Thanks Cooperman435 for the swift response ...... my No 1 concern is keeping within the laws and from what you said It will be best to apply for one.....I do make  BP and Perc Flash so definitely am " manufacturing" explosive substances . be it in very small amounts ...... the wise thing is to apply for sure . Im new to pyro regulations so your input is much appreciated ....I suppose £40 or so isn't too bad to keep yourself safe from any trouble with the authorities ..... thanks again Cooperman ....